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So how do you respond to the fact that this proud atheist donates to the United Way, the Red Cross, has done volunteer work with poor children, sent care packages to soldiers, and so forth? What about the other atheists I know in Engineers Without Borders, the Peace Corp, the Red Cross, Habitat for Humanity, and so forth? It is great that many Christians also roll up their sleves and work to make the world a better place. That kind of work is something we can all agree on.
Who is this "you" you are referring to?
I have never claimed I "do so much to make the world a better place,"
I wish that I did, though
"Social conservatives never claimed they're immune to sin, they claim the right to decide what sin is."
Who gave them that "right"?
"And they've earned that right because they read the Bible more or have more respect for tradition or a keener eye for slippery slopes or some factor they would probably have trouble pinning down precisely."
That is an insult to every Christian Democrat. Do only Christian Conservatives "read the Bible?"
If I read you correctly, "reading the bible" gives one "more respect for tradition, etc.?" Perhaps if you had said "observing the teachings of the Bible", your statement may have had a little more credibility.
"So if you're a proud atheist, are you for or against adultery?"
No, I am not an atheist, I am a Christian, but what's that got to do with the issue at hand? And can atheists not be "proud" of what they are? Who are we, Christians, to judge?
And yes, I am against adultery, as the Bible teaches us. But I don't go around beating up Conservatives for it. Democrats and Conservatives alike commit adultery. I am against the political hypocrisy of a party that uses morality , family values and religion to beat up the opposition.
"your criticism should be directed at Mark Sanford who committed it, not the many conservatives who didn't."
Please, read my post again. My criticism is directed against Republican Governor Sanford and against Republican polticians who have used, and contiue to use, the "values, morality and religion" slogans to club and diminish the opposition/
Thank you for commenting on my post without ad hominen
The letter you posted doesn't address Mark Sanford. He isn't mentioned at all. It says, "It's over, Republicans." and talks about people who "pretend to talk to God." The post says that the reason a LTE is to "set the record straight." It does nothing of the sort.
"The letter you posted doesn't address Mark Sanford. He isn't mentioned at all. It says, "It's over, Republicans." and talks about people who "pretend to talk to God."
Written a few days after the Sanford episode, it is very likely it addressed Sanford. If not, it could have addressed John Ensign, Larry Craig, David Vitter, Mark Foley, Ted Haggart, Matthew Joseph Elliott, Robert McKee, Robert "Bob" Allen, John David Roy Atcheson, Richard Curtis, Ted Klaudt, Jim Gibbons...you get the idea
Sorry, as you don't have access to the newspaper, let me describe what appears directly above the letter:
It is a small color photograph of Governor Sanford wiping a tear, with the following caption:
"Republican South Carolina Gov. Mark Sanford admitted Wednesday to cheating on his wife."
Hypocrisy, Thy name is Christian Conservative.
Perhaps this is one of those religious charitable "efforts" Thurmanhart was extolling, and comparing to alleged atheist lack of charitable actions.
snip
"Perhaps this is one of those religious charitable "efforts" Thurmanhart was extolling, and comparing to alleged atheist lack of charitable actions."
hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows.
More of the "condemn the group for the actions of one person" stuff. Wonderful.
"hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows
Taylor and Pat Robertson"
I am sorry, but I don't see anything funny in what Don Quijote posted about the alleged diamond mines business dealings of American televangelist Pat Robertson, who "used his Operation Blessing planes to haul diamond-mining equipment to Robertson's mines in Liberia, despite the fact that Robertson was telling his 700 Club viewers that the planes were sending relief supplies to the victims of the genocide in Rwanda."
You know, you're much too smart to post this. It's obvious that I wasn't laughing at what DQ wrote. I was laughing at YOU for saying that it was a "charitable effort." Come on, if you're going to play dumb, this is useless.
""Hypocrisy, Thy name is Christian Conservative."
"hahahahahaha...you are SO funny. You should try out for one of those reality shows"
Don Quijote will be pleased to learn this
"You can go to church seven days a week and pray seven times a day. You’re just human beings. No better than anybody else."
"I've never met anyone who claimed different." Just listen to the Religious Right and you'll find some who indeed "claim different, in particular as to who "is eligible" to "be saved" in the after life
"As a proud atheist, I will put my morals up against Pat Robertson, George W. Bush or anyone else who pretends to speak to God. Get over yourselves and work with the rest of us to make our country and the rest of the world a better place."
"Wow, what a great example of someone blaming someone else for the problem they are a party to! "
What problem are you referring to? Being an atheist?
"Oh, what a relief it must be to be an atheist and not have to be responsible for getting along with other people!"
Please explain. Do you know atheists who don't "have to be responsible for getting along with other people!" ? What does this mean?
"Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to those of the Southern Baptist in rebuilding houses after Katrina. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" with the Episcopal Development Corporation in providing affordable housing and getting homeless families into homes. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to the efforts of the United Methodist Women in providing blankets to the homeless or in providing medicinal aid to the Pacific islands."
I am not an atheist, but I am sure atheists do just as many good deeds for the poor, the needy, the homeless, etc. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
The fact that atheist organizations or individuals don't tout their charitable acts, doesn't necessarily mean they don't do them
Thanks for your comments
It means that the letter you site claims that things will get better when the Religious Right changes...instead of trying to learn to get along with them. It puts the responsibility of getting along with someone else.
"I am not an atheist, but I am sure atheists do just as many good deeds for the poor, the needy, the homeless, etc. Do you have any evidence to the contrary?
The fact that atheist organizations or individuals don't tout their charitable acts, doesn't necessarily mean they don't do them."
I never claimed that atheists don't give to the poor, etc. However, the letter claims that the Religious Right is well known for "who they are." Those are just a few examples of who they are. And, by the way, it isn't about touting what they do, it's the fact that they cared enough to organize and do something. Sure, atheists can do that, and some do, but if we're going to compare groups, then let's actually compare groups, shall we?
Thanks for clarifying your comments and giving atheists some credit.
I've never met anyone who claimed different. This is a fantastic example of a major strawman! Thanks for finding it!
"As a proud atheist, I will put my morals up against Pat Robertson, George W. Bush or anyone else who pretends to speak to God. Get over yourselves and work with the rest of us to make our country and the rest of the world a better place."
Wow, what a great example of someone blaming someone else for the problem they are a party to! Yes, it is those other people who must change so we can make progress! Oh, what a relief it must be to be an atheist and not have to be responsible for getting along with other people! Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to those of the Southern Baptist in rebuilding houses after Katrina. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" with the Episcopal Development Corporation in providing affordable housing and getting homeless families into homes. Let's compare the efforts of "proud atheists" to the efforts of the United Methodist Women in providing blankets to the homeless or in providing medicinal aid to the Pacific islands.
I agree! This sets the entire record straight!
So if you're a proud atheist, are you for or against adultery? If you don't have a problem with it, beating up conservatives for practicing it just buys in to their definitions of right and wrong. If you do, you're in violent agreement with the conservatives, and your criticism should be directed at Mark Sanford who committed it, not the many conservatives who didn't.
"(And get this) According to Williams Jones, president of Columbia International University, Mr. Sanford and his wife joined an intensive Bible study group in the last few months. (A very Republican thing to do)"
http://open.salon.com/blog/middleagedwomanblogg...
Please read my post again. Nowhere do I condemn "the whole group". I specifically single out Republican politicians and a Republican Party that that, "in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party."
And:
"CODA: I truly believe that all Americans, Republicans, Democrats, or whatever, share virtues and failings equally, including politicians. However, when politicians of either party, or the party itself, use such virtues or failings to vilify the entire opposition, it is not only hypocritical, it’s just wrong.
And, yes, Democratic politicians have been guilty, too."
And, no I did not write the letter, and yes, I found it to be a very relevant letter to the ongoing discussion about hypocrisy.
Yes, you are right. The "Republican Party" is not a group at all, is it?
I agree that it is a wonderful example of hypocrisy. Just not the way you want to use it.
Thurmanhart, this is getting a little tiresome, and this will be the last time that I encourage to read my entire post again, very slowly and very carefully, where I clearly said:
"on the recent succession of moral and family values transgressions by politicians of the Party that, in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party."
Again, "politicians of the party that..."
Anyway, it has been, as you say, very entertaining.
Thanks for spending so much time on my post. It's appreciated.
have a wonderful weekend.
"The problem is that the letter you wrote is an ad hominem attack itself"
Please read the post again. I did not write the letter.
Like I said, you can name all you want and it's still a small fraction. Why not single out "white men" for the outrage..all of those examples are white men, after all.
Oh, Thurmanhart, you know very well that sin knows no race, or gender... or, surprise, religion
I have. Each time, I'm less impressed with it.
Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to get my children ready for Bible study. I suppose that means I'll have to change my voter registration so I fit with the ongoing meme. Just as well, I find Democrats to be as full of hate for people who aren't like them as Republicans ever have been. No less, no more.
I believe that's great, Thurmanhart.
I wish more people, Democrats and Republicans, would pay more attention to their children spiritual needs--whoever their God might be, or not be
Thurmanhart says: "I have."
Well, did you read something to the effect of :
"the recent succession of moral and family values transgressions by politicians of the Party that, in my opinion, have claimed those values to be exclusively theirs and, moreover, have attempted to use such alleged moral and religious superiority to malign and marginalize members of the opposing Party. "
"Politicians of the Party" "Politicians of the Party" "Politicians of the Party"