The Moderate Voice - Latest Comments in Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 00:32:04 -0000

I love my cats too, but they are so predictable I don&#39t need to worry about herding them. My Aussie tries sometimes... with limited success.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

dduck12 — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:29:02 -0000

I love my cat, but If I want her to not meander, I shake a bag of kitty chews or open a can of cat food. The Reps need to do that when they catch the Dems trying to cure all that ails the world.
BTW: I chose not to use a picture of her but to use the logo above because "Duckman" is the poster duck for the Liberal who got mugged.
Simply, it was the best animated TV series for cynical/optimistic people like me.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Rambie — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:17:28 -0000

"Independents are herds of cats who find out what they think through a meandering process of discovery. "

I find that more than a little condescending.

As opposed to what Mr Brooks, the ones who ask no questions and just vote as you tell them to vote? How dare anyone, as Polimom said so well, "continually evaluating and reevaluating my positions on things" Is it really such an inconvenience to have to defend your positions when some of these "herds of cats" actually ask thoughtful questions and expect thoughtful answers?

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:10:50 -0000

Exactly right prof, from what I see the electorate is in a bad mood right across the board... as they should be.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

ProfElwood — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:53:58 -0000

The GOP is struggling because they increased spending, which alienated the conservatives and libertarian leaning, increased government snooping, which alienated the liberals and libertarian leaning, and repealed the wrong regulations (the ones that worked, not the ones that would increase competition), which alienated the sane. They&#39re now trying to say "trust us, we&#39ll fix this" again, but it looks very much like trying to spin exactly what they have right now. Sorry, I&#39ll trust them when they earn it, not before.

My only surprise is that liberal leaning voters haven&#39t figured out that the Democrats are basically betraying them also. The Democrats have expanded on illegal wiretapping instead of putting safeguards in, cut deals with the MedMob to increase expenses, including the poor, cut back on individual benefits while increasing corporate benefits, and shown just as much fiscal irresponsibility as the Republicans did.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 19:52:28 -0000

"independents may be trending conservative to some degree, but I&#39m not sure why that would mean trending toward the GOP"

1. This was not a pro-GOP 1994 vote. This was an anti-lib-Dem, dissatisfied-with-state-of-affairs vote.

2. The "opposition" (including much independent or swing voters) was motivated. The Dem voters, notably the farther-left voters (e.g., "robust public option"), were unmotivated or as confused and bumbling as the Dems have been in past weeks.

3. The typical protests (free of liberal media bias and play-pen-bloggerish slander) reveal a non-liberal public fraction that is like the GOP, which has been dysfunctional and notably incoherent (struggling for coherence, in fact, as a primary remedial goal) for much longer and in much broader a way than the Dems. Aside from fighting the health care takeover, protesters are a mixed bag of people with all kinds of concerns, social and fiscal or financial being an obvious distinction in both goals and "factions."

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 19:32:04 -0000

I love my cats too, but they are so predictable I don't need to worry about herding them. My Aussie tries sometimes... with limited success.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 19:16:06 -0000

Well, independents may be trending conservative to some degree, but I&#39m not sure why that would mean trending toward the GOP - a party which seems to have serious problems finding a clue lately. In any case, it&#39s a point in time and a point on a graph - longterm effects remain to be seen. As for David Brooks? I thought he was just a foil for Mark Shields. ;-)

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:56:27 -0000

What&#39s next? Banning "ticket splitting," of course, and later, banning swing voting, requiring pre-declaration or legal vote pledging before participating in elections. (Banning the GOP can come later.)

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:55:45 -0000

Brooks is just joining others in his peer group, most more liberal, in clucking his concern about and trying to "explain" the public&#39s tempestuous, unprogrammatic, un-DC-centric-conformative behavior.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

dduck12 — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:29:02 -0000

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Rambie — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:17:28 -0000

"Independents are herds of cats who find out what they think through a meandering process of discovery. "

I find that more than a little condescending.

As opposed to what Mr Brooks, the ones who ask no questions and just vote as you tell them to vote? How dare anyone, as Polimom said so well, "continually evaluating and reevaluating my positions on things" Is it really such an inconvenience to have to defend your positions when some of these "herds of cats" actually ask thoughtful questions and expect thoughtful answers?

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:10:50 -0000

Exactly right prof, from what I see the electorate is in a bad mood right across the board... as they should be.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

casualobserver — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:01:51 -0000

I think there are indeed "independents" that let political platforms of the day shape their beliefs, i.e., your meandering cats....e.g. people who voted for Bush, then voted for Obama.

However, I also believe there are independents whose beliefs are set and then go looking for a political party that best aligns with those. If I ever met a Democrat that didn&#39t want to spend my money everyday, I might be willing to switch since I prefer the more libertarian social views of the Ds.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

ProfElwood — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:53:58 -0000

The GOP is struggling because they increased spending, which alienated the conservatives and libertarian leaning, increased government snooping, which alienated the liberals and libertarian leaning, and repealed the wrong regulations (the ones that worked, not the ones that would increase competition), which alienated the sane. They're now trying to say "trust us, we'll fix this" again, but it looks very much like trying to spin exactly what they have right now. Sorry, I'll trust them when they earn it, not before.

My only surprise is that liberal leaning voters haven't figured out that the Democrats are basically betraying them also. The Democrats have expanded on illegal wiretapping instead of putting safeguards in, cut deals with the MedMob to increase expenses, including to the poor, cut back on individual benefits while increasing corporate benefits, and shown just as much fiscal irresponsibility as the Republicans did.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

dduck12 — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:45:50 -0000

It is sometimes an idiot that calls someone else one. Brooks is just too not-liberal for you. I am also somewhat of a meandering cat and hope Brooks is correct, but I think this election was just a disappointment vote because "change" was not fast enough for impatient folks, and yes they wanted the incumbent out.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DaGoat — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:41:26 -0000

One person&#39s meander is another&#39s journey of personal growth and learning. Brooks&#39 position is actually fairly close to Rush Limbaugh, who portrays independents and moderates as shallow immoral people paralyzed by indecision.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Silhouette — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:38:10 -0000

You know it&#39s funny..

When words get turned into labels, buzzwords, they lose their meaning.

Let&#39s revisit the "shocking" definition of independent.
Source: dictionary.com
in?de?pend?ent??/??nd??p?nd?nt/
1. not influenced or controlled by others in matters of opinion, conduct, etc.; thinking or acting for oneself: an independent thinker.
2. not subject to another&#39s authority or jurisdiction; autonomous; free: an independent businessman.
3. not influenced by the thought or action of others: independent research.
4. not dependent; not depending or contingent upon something else for existence, operation, etc.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Polimom — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:30:16 -0000

Gotta disagree with Ron here. I often like and agree with Brooks. That said -- I agree with you, Pete. I&#39m continually evaluating and reevaluating my positions on things. I guess it could be described as a meander, though I don&#39t feel nearly as random as that word implies.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

Ron Beasley — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 16:22:18 -0000

Brooks is an idiot. Both you and I are worth more than Brooks. If he was writing for free like we do it would still be too much. nuff said!

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 14:52:28 -0000

"independents may be trending conservative to some degree, but I'm not sure why that would mean trending toward the GOP"

1. This was not a pro-GOP 1994 vote. This was an anti-lib-Dem, dissatisfied-with-state-of-affairs vote.

2. The "opposition" (including much independent or swing voters) was motivated. The Dem voters, notably the farther-left voters (e.g., "robust public option"), were unmotivated or as confused and bumbling as the Dems have been in past weeks.

3. The typical protests (free of liberal media bias and play-pen-bloggerish slander) reveal a non-liberal public fraction that is like the GOP, which has been dysfunctional and notably incoherent (struggling for coherence, in fact, as a primary remedial goal) for much longer and in much broader a way than the Dems. Aside from fighting the health care takeover, protesters are a mixed bag of people with all kinds of concerns, social and fiscal or financial being an obvious distinction in both goals and "factions."

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

JSpencer — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 14:16:06 -0000

Well, independents may be trending conservative to some degree, but I'm not sure why that would mean trending toward the GOP - a party which seems to have serious problems finding a clue lately. In any case, it's a point in time and a point on a graph - longterm effects remain to be seen. As for David Brooks? I thought he was just a foil for Mark Shields. ;-)

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 12:56:27 -0000

What's next? Banning "ticket splitting," of course, and later, banning swing voting, requiring pre-declaration or legal vote pledging before participating in elections. (Banning the GOP can come later.)

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

DLS — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 12:55:45 -0000

Brooks is just joining others in his peer group, most more liberal, in clucking his concern about and trying to "explain" the public's tempestuous, unprogrammatic, un-DC-centric-conformative behavior.

Re: Brooks: Independents are Meandering Cats

casualobserver — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 12:01:51 -0000

I think there are indeed "independents" that let political platforms of the day shape their beliefs, i.e., your meandering cats....e.g. people who voted for Bush, then voted for Obama.

However, I also believe there are independents whose beliefs are set and then go looking for a political party that best aligns with those. If I ever met a Democrat that didn't want to spend my money everyday, I might be willing to switch since I prefer the more libertarian social views of the Ds.