The Moderate Voice - Latest Comments in House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

ProfElwood — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 06:49:39 -0000

"Oh you must be talking about Social Security. SSI was well planned and would have been completely viable had the conservatives under Reagan not robbed the SSI coffers."

The SSI coffers were robbed in 1965, under a Democratic president and Democratic congress.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_Ac...

Reagan, by the way, made the biggest increases in welfare of any recent president, as a way of buying off the Democrats for his military spending. He should be your hero.

"The New Deal was the best deal this country ever created. It actually saved capitalism. Without it, there would be a lot of dead capitalists and red flags flying around."
I&#39ll make some popcorn, please tell me tale.

"Besides, the addition of government jobs negates your premise. Deductions are taken from government jobs also. The state of our capitalism remains far to much uncontrolled capitalism, which is the very reason for our current economic woes. Out of control greed from undisciplined self serving capitalists."
I know you&#39re trying to say something, but somehow, I&#39m not able to pull an exact meaning out of it. If you&#39re including the bipartisan repeal of Glass-Steagall being a big factor in this downturn, I&#39d have to agree. Ditto for them lobbying for laws that limit competition, protect industries from normal civil lawsuits, legalize deceptions, limit informed choices, and bail out failures. What kinds of laws do you want passed or repealed?

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

ProfElwood — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 01:49:39 -0000

"Oh you must be talking about Social Security. SSI was well planned and would have been completely viable had the conservatives under Reagan not robbed the SSI coffers."

The SSI coffers were robbed in 1965, under a Democratic president and Democratic congress.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Security_Ac...

Reagan, by the way, made the biggest increases in welfare of any recent president, as a way of buying off the Democrats for his military spending. He should be your hero.

"The New Deal was the best deal this country ever created. It actually saved capitalism. Without it, there would be a lot of dead capitalists and red flags flying around."
I'll make some popcorn, please tell me the tale.

"Besides, the addition of government jobs negates your premise. Deductions are taken from government jobs also. The state of our capitalism remains far to much uncontrolled capitalism, which is the very reason for our current economic woes. Out of control greed from undisciplined self serving capitalists."
I know you're trying to say something, but somehow, I'm not able to pull an exact meaning out of it. If you're including the bipartisan repeal of Glass-Steagall being a big factor in this downturn, I'd have to agree. Ditto for them lobbying for laws that limit competition, protect industries from normal civil lawsuits, legalize deceptions, limit informed choices, and bail out failures. What kinds of laws do you want passed or repealed?

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 01:35:59 -0000

Right. You need to check real statistics not propaganda crapola. The Europeans are doing just fine and have surpassed our "glorious capitalists" leaving them in the dust.

Business exists everywhere on the planet eons before the United States ever existed. It will exist forever. Separate business from capitalism and suddenly you understand where the excesses lay and why capitalism is now as redundant as Andrew Carnegie.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 01:24:49 -0000

Oh you must be talking about Social Security. SSI was well planned and would have been completely viable had the conservatives under Reagan not robbed the SSI coffers. I suppose you would just leave these people to die.

The New Deal was the best deal this country ever created. It actually saved capitalism. Without it, there would be a lot of dead capitalists and red flags flying around.

Besides, the addition of government jobs negates your premise. They take deductions from government jobs also. The state of capitalism remains far to much uncontrolled capitalism. Which is the very reason for our current economic woes. Out of control greed from undisciplined self serving capitalists.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

ProfElwood — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:41:21 -0000

Before the Federal Reserve and the New Deal, we were both the tortoise and the hare. We now have more people living off of government money than earn it in the private sector. That&#39s a pretty clear indication of the state of "capitalism" in our country.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:35:59 -0000

Right. You need to check real statistics not propaganda crapola. The Europeans are doing just fine and have surpassed our "glorious capitalists" leaving them in the dust.

Business exists everywhere on the planet eons before the United States ever existed. It will exist forever. Separate business from capitalism and suddenly you understand where the excesses lay and why capitalism is now as redundant as Andrew Carnegie.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:24:49 -0000

Oh you must be talking about Social Security. SSI was well planned and would have been completely viable had the conservatives under Reagan not robbed the SSI coffers. I suppose you would just leave these people to die.

The New Deal was the best deal this country ever created. It actually saved capitalism. Without it, there would be a lot of dead capitalists and red flags flying around.

Besides, the addition of government jobs negates your premise. Deductions are taken from government jobs also. The state of our capitalism remains far to much uncontrolled capitalism, which is the very reason for our current economic woes. Out of control greed from undisciplined self serving capitalists.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

ProfElwood — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 16:41:21 -0000

Before the Federal Reserve and the New Deal, we were both the tortoise and the hare. We now have more people living off of government money than earn it in the private sector. That's a pretty clear indication of the state of "capitalism" in our country.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

AustinRoth — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 13:51:45 -0000

Interesting that you pick third world countries to make your point

What?? Obviously you did not read the article, only my excerpt. It was talking about the previous major attempt at socialism (USSR), its failure, the fact that indeed those small countries are now trying it, and we seem to be headed down a somewhat similar path.

You really need to try and not beclown yourself so much via simple ignorance and laziness.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 11:41:29 -0000

Depends on just what kind of Socialism you are talking about. The Socialism I seek is western European Socialism where the people&#39s standard of living is higher than here. Where 750 million people do NOT want to be like America. Where everybody has healthcare and in Germany, retirement is age 58. Where the unemployed live better than our under employed.

Interesting that you pick third world countries to make your point, not first, or, even second world nations which by using would destroy your point.

Alas, the mechanism of conservative propaganda is revealed. Can’t even get it past the six graders anymore. Must be why you are the minority. Please, join us and be happy! More Harleys in Europe than here! You will love it!

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 11:30:29 -0000

To much political diversity results in to much indecision, un-decision, ineptitude, and, waste.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 11:26:30 -0000

The United States is already "to far one way". The United States is the most capitalist nation on earth. Unfortunately it&#39s people&#39s standard of living are far down the list from the "most" of anything. It has only been working "best" since WWII due to a lack of competition. Even then, the only way it could stay ahead, for a few decades anyway, was by uncontrolled capitalism. Now, socialism has passed us up and are looking back at us laughing. Classic tortoise and the hare scenario. We are the stupid hare, the socialists are the wise and well prepared tortoise.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

AustinRoth — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:51:45 -0000

Interesting that you pick third world countries to make your point

You really need to try and not beclown yourself so much via simple ignorance and laziness.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 06:41:29 -0000

Depends on just what kind of Socialism you are talking about. The Socialism I seek is western European Socialism where the people's standard of living is higher than here. Where 750 million people do NOT want to be like America. Where everybody has healthcare and in Germany, retirement is age 58. Where the unemployed live better than our under employed.

Interesting that you pick third world countries to make your point, not first, or, even second world nations which by using would destroy your point.

Alas, the mechanism of conservative propaganda is revealed. Can’t even get it past the six graders anymore. Must be why you are the minority. Please, join us and be happy! More Harleys in Europe than here! You will love it!

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 06:30:29 -0000

To much political diversity results in to much indecision, un-decision, ineptitude, and, waste.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 06:26:30 -0000

The United States is already "to far one way". The United States is the most capitalist nation on earth. Unfortunately it's people's standard of living are far down the list from the "most" of anything. It has only been working "best" since WWII due to a lack of competition. Even then, the only way it could stay ahead, for a few decades anyway, was by uncontrolled capitalism. Now, socialism has passed us up and are looking back at us laughing. Classic tortoise and the hare scenario. We are the stupid hare, the socialists are the wise and well prepared tortoise.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

JSpencer — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 06:02:24 -0000

The US has always worked best when it functioned as a blend of capitalism and socialism. When the balance tips too far one way or the other then we get problems. That said, the limbutts and the beckerheads don&#39t really have a grasp of what the two concepts really are to begin with (or their place in our history), nor are they any better at figuring out what is happening around them present day. Frustration and parroting noise aren&#39t very good subs for actual knowledge and understanding - and only lead to a lot of foolish banter on political forums. Of course I&#39m not referring to TMV here. ;-)

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

AustinRoth — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 02:20:07 -0000

In spite of its monumental failure to bring social peace and material abundance, socialism is enjoying something of a renaissance. From Venezuela to Bolivia to South Africa, government ministers espouse the supposed virtues of socialism. Even in the West, some policies are taking government intervention in the economy to levels unseen in decades. Given the renewed interest in alternatives to capitalism, it is perhaps appropriate to recall the last time that socialism was tried with real gusto.

ht: Instapundit (again)

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

dduck12 — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 01:27:29 -0000

Is it nice to only see black and white?

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

JSpencer — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 01:02:24 -0000

The US has always worked best when it functioned as a blend of capitalism and socialism. When the balance tips too far one way or the other then we get problems. That said, the limbutts and the beckerheads don't really have a grasp of what the two concepts really are to begin with (or their place in our history), nor are they any better at figuring out what is happening around them present day. Frustration and parroting noise aren't very good subs for actual knowledge and understanding - and only lead to a lot of foolish banter on political forums. Of course I'm not referring to TMV here. ;-)

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 00:57:09 -0000

Yes of course. The republicans have destroyed our economy and there is nothing left but Socialism for a prosperous, equitably distributed national wealth. Just like the rest of the modern world.

Uncontrolled Capitalism’s goose is cooked. Have a slice and smile.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

Father_Time — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 00:50:10 -0000

How could anybody miss? They scream their stupidity every chance they get.

Alas, nobody cares.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

kathykattenburg — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 00:45:16 -0000

Actually, Leonidas, nobody said health care was free. No one ever said that. So I don&#39t know where you get that from.

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

AustinRoth — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 21:20:07 -0000

ht: Instapundit (again)

Re: House Passes Health Care Bill But Future Unclear

dduck12 — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 20:27:29 -0000

Is it nice to only see black and white?