The Moderate Voice - Latest Comments in McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Jill Miller Zimon — Sun, 15 Jun 2008 08:17:55 -0000

aba23 Thanks for the link - for some folks, it may be enough. For me, I will be honest - I'm not voting for him anyway, from what I can tell you right now. But for women on the fence, well - he really has a pretty abysmal record and is in the old patriarchy, good old boys mold. Sure, he's admirable for many things - but promoting policy and legislation that eradicates the discrimination and mistreatment of women and others who are other unrepresented or underrepresented? That is not what he champions and that negatively impacts those groups - women included.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Jill Miller Zimon — Sun, 15 Jun 2008 08:07:14 -0000

TeaFizz - no one should feel that way and I would guess that you do because people are too quick to slap down others . That's a real problem and something I try to prevent from happening on my personal blog - no one should be made fun of for asking a question - if it's sincere.

Anyway - thanks for leaving your thoughts. I do disagree - I think that the fact that Williams hasn't done anything that we know of to alter this image of him, that in itself says something, and something big. To me and to some others, anyway. I agree about not judging a person per se but this isn't about Williams - this is about McCain and his acceptance of this persons's assistance. These actions DO say something about each of us -not only politicians.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

aba23 — Sun, 15 Jun 2008 07:47:56 -0000

So much for doing the right thing; he's keeping the money (http://thepage.time.com/200.... I stand corrected on all counts.

It's not the tactic I'd use to try to win over Clinton supporters.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

TeaFizz — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 15:58:13 -0000

Sure... Williams certainly didn't do himself any favors by not more actively "rehabilitating" his image after the fact. Nevertheless, regardless of how well-known this incident was, it is still only *one* incident.

Although I knew about Williams and his incident before reading your post, I don't know much more about him other than that which you mentioned, so I won't make any claims as to the type of person he is or what he believes.

Still, I just can't justify making the same leap you did, at least, not based on that information alone.

With respect to McCain's defense of Williams, politics is politics, and fairness and logic don't necessarily play into it. McCain could just be waiting to see the direction public opinion takes before deciding on a course of action.

But I'll freely admit to pretty much being a political idiot. That's why I usually adhere to the adage that "it's better to be silent and thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt," as I have a tendency to incriminate myself.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Jill Miller Zimon — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 14:37:31 -0000

I disagree with you on who has the burden. Williams has the burden to show how that remark does not define him. I've read materials that assert just how well-known this incident of his is. If he'd turned around the image associated with it, wouldn't you expect then that McCain would defend Williams as a legitimate ally?

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

TeaFizz — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 12:41:24 -0000

oops... sorry for the double-post

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

TeaFizz — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 12:39:03 -0000

I'm not defending the remark itself (I agree that it was distasteful and completely inappropriate), but denouncing a person based solely on a single remark made eighteen years ago is bunk.

I'm not going to try and tell you that words don't matter, but should we really fly off the handle every time someone makes an off-color remark? Is a single statement by someone really enough to be able to form an "informed" opinion regarding their inner beliefs and core values?

Were Williams' remark part of a whole pattern or trend of misogynistic remarks/behavior, I might be inclined to agree with you, but, until you can show that - and not that he's guilty of exercising horrible judgment in which dirty joke to tell at one thus-far-isolated point in his life - I have to say that I find your self-righteous attitude more than a little unfounded.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

TeaFizz — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 12:38:55 -0000

I'm not defending the remark itself (I agree that it was distasteful and completely inappropriate), but denouncing a person based solely on a single remark made eighteen years ago is bunk.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Jill Miller Zimon — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 10:43:12 -0000

aba23, you know what? You are right. McCain should get credit - if he gives the money back or donates it. Otherwise, it's not a meaningful gesture to simply cancel the event. But yes - you are right - he should get props from women AND men if he follows through.

As for thoroughly vetting, this case isn't the one where you want to make that argument. In Texas political and fundraising circles, this individual and this incident are widely known. Not to mention the sums of money involved.

However, as I wrote on my blog earlier today, the point is this: people can proffer money to any candidate they want. The candidate gets to choose the rules by which they're going to accept the money. Obama has been very clear about certain funding streams from which he just won't accept. When we're talking about the potential president of the United States, it's hard to make the argument that we shouldn't care how $300,000 was raised to support him or her.

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

aba23 — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 10:05:17 -0000

I do not support McCain, but if his campaign's response was to cancel the event when they heard about the tasteless remark, then why is this another reason for women not to choose him (which isn't to say there aren't plenty enough as it is)? It seems utterly impractical to expect every single person affiliated with the candidates to be thoroughly vetted. (Okay, maybe a 1-minute Google search would've done it this time, but maybe not.)

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

Jill Miller Zimon — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 08:43:57 -0000

Thanks, StockBoy. Over at my blog, this comment was left by a blogger I know well and do consider a friend - though we definitely have disagreements:

"OK, I know that being a guy and all my opinions on such matters don't count, but for freaking sake, do we really want to do this? Yes, the Republican Noise Machine has perfected the tactic of You Are Who Your Worst Supporter Is, but do we really want to wallow in that gutter with them?

It was a stupid, offensive, insensitive remark made eighteen years ago. People will vote in this election who weren't born when Williams said what he said. Do we really want to create a political world in which mere words have the effect of permanently exiling a person from participation in public life?"

It took me a nanosecond to say, "yes."

Re: McCain campaign cancels event w/TX oilman who compared rape to the weather

StockBoySF — Fri, 13 Jun 2008 22:51:40 -0000

McCain campaign spokesman Brian Rogers... said he could not yet say what McCain would do with donations brought into the campaign by Williams."

Really? Like McCain has a choice on what to do with the money? I think it's a no-brainer and as was suggested, McCain shoudl donate all $300k (or however much) to an organization to combat rape (or abuse) in our society.