The Moderate Voice - Latest Comments in Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

jeff327327 — Sat, 23 Aug 2008 09:54:18 -0000

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Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

DLS — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 18:05:03 -0000

"Dukakis was not leading a movement, Obama has a huge following that fervently supports him."

And Dukakis was a Massachusetts liberal, just like someone else who had no huge following -- Kerry.

Obama has come out of nowhere to be taken very seriously. I believe, and I believe most believe, that Obama is the favored candidate this year, whereas McCain is a contemporary copy of Bob Dole.

And,

"The Obama brand has already cornered the market on people who genuinely want change. McCain is trying to poach that market based on his being the 'original maverick'."

McCain does this at the expense of his many, often-defied fellow Republicans and at the expense of the rest of us who are non-liberal or conservative and see too often with McCain a Dem Lite, or someone being deliberately controversial to "his own" [sic] merely to get attention for himself.

Notice that a lot of criticism by libs and Dems at this very moment of Joe Lieberman is (likely often unwittingly) the same as what has been said for ages already about McCain. In that eerie way, Lieberman is the perfect VP choice for McCain, but I doubt it will change McCain's prospects for election this year at all. (McCain needs a token true conservative or even one who Just Says So like Romney for VP in order to do better.)

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

joep — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 15:44:27 -0000

With all due respect, I am really tired of people relying on a campaign that happened 20 years ago and picking a couple of convenient facts to conclude that the exact result will occur again. Other comments have already raised salient differences between 2008 and 1988. Dukakis was dull, Obama has presence. Dukakis was a governer with NO international experience, Obama is a US Senator with some experience, Dukakis was not leading a movement, Obama has a huge following that fervently supports him. In addition, Obama has the money Dukakis does not have. Obama is running in an environment where the international threat is a bunch of thugs holed up in Pakistan who need to be taken out while Dukakis faced the perceived threat of the Red Bear with shared Nuclear annihilation.

Biden knows international threats and can shoot down ridiculous responses raised by any surrogate that McCain can throw at him. The greatest use of a VP candidate in an election is as the attack dog surrogate while the Presidenial candidate stays above the fray. If there is one attack dog I could point to in the Democratic party that will fill that role, it is Joe Biden. He will call an attack what it is, will pull no punches and will be unapologetic about it.

Selecting a VP candidate to win a particular state is over rated, other than LBJ winning Texas for Kennedy in 1960, point to one state where that strategy has made a difference.

The Obama brand has already cornered the market on people who genuinely want change. McCain is trying to poach that market based on his being the "original maverick". Unfortunately for him there is too much recent history to show that it is nothing more than spin. What is holding Obama back is the concern that he does not have the bona fide skills to address international problems. Biden solves that problem. More importantly, he would fill the role as the attack dog that Obama is uncomfortable with doing.

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

kritt11 — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:24:57 -0000

Biden would shore up the Obama campaign in the realm of experience and national security cred, the candidate's chief weaknesses.

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

kritt11 — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:23:01 -0000

I agree with the others- Dukakis sunk Dukakis. He had no charisma and did not hit back hard enough after the Bush campaign smeared him with Willie Horton. Bentsen was a more attractive candidate than Dukakis and performed well in debates against the less intellectually endowed Dan Quale.

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

el_loco1965 — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:49:56 -0000

Bentsen sinking Dukakis? What the heck are you talking about? Lloyd Bentsen didn't hurt Dukakis, but he didn't help him either. Besides, the reason he didn't carry Texas was that George H. W. Bush, who was running for President - not VP - was also from Texas.

Are you also forgetting Willie Horton? And that brutal, below-the-belt death penalty question from Bernard Shaw - and Dukakis dumbfounding answer? And the photo-op of Dukakis riding a tank? Fair or not, all these things helped define Dukakis in a very unflattering light.

Also keep in mind that Biden would be running for VP, not President, so his success as a presidential candidate is neither here nor there. The role of the VP candidate in a campaign is substantially different from that of the Presidential candidate.

Is Biden the perfect candidate? No. But if this is the pick, Obama could definitely do much worse.

Personally, I think the best candidate would be Clinton. If you're going to pick an inside-the-beltway type, why not go with someone who can deliver a substantial number of voters too? But it won't happen.

Don't forget that Al Gore didn't do so well either in '88.

Re: Obama / Biden 2008 or is it 1988 all over again?

Dorian — Wed, 20 Aug 2008 11:39:24 -0000

Lloyd Bentsen is no Joe Biden.

Joe Biden has dearly paid for the plagiarism incident. If that's the worst dirt Republicans can throw at him, we'll take our chances--Joe Biden will throw the mud right back at them, twice as hard.