The Moderate Voice - Latest Comments in Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

Jovian — Tue, 11 Nov 2008 11:16:57 -0000

I am so disappointed at the outcome of the vote. I was so for Obama and now to learn the AA community are a bunch of hypocrites. As a result, if the banning of affirmative action comes t o my state I will actively endorse it and help the campaign. I was so happy about Obama, but now when I look at him I am slightly disgusted. I know he didn't campaign for it, but he represents someone that finally got black people to vote and the result was good and ugly. I will never look at the AA community the same again.

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

archangel — Sun, 09 Nov 2008 03:24:07 -0000

I dont think people are scapegoating black people on prop 8, unless they dont understand the situ at root as a set of demographics of which people 'by race' are vote-counted a certain way. I, personally, find counting votes by race, useless in most contexts, because it doesnt get to the social, psychological, economic class, educational, religious beliefs of persons in that group... which are often quite diverse.

Tyrone is accurate: blacks, and speaking for my own group, Latinos, (insofar as I can as just one person who travels a great deal and listens to many from my own heritage) are often religiously conservative and social-program supportive. It is likely that ANY group of persons voting to amend the constitution of Calif to ban gay marriage, has amongst them people who believe gays ought not exist, as well as people who want gays to have every right others enjoy. However, the deciding factor is probably dedication to certain religious beliefs, not race per se.

I thought that the 'under 30' demographic, as reported, voting in huge numbers to not ammend the constitution and not ban gay marriage, was the most interesting outcome of the issue. Hopeful.

It must be noted too, I think, that in the GLBT community, no one person can speak for all the others about the outcome of Prop 8. There too, there is a plethora of reactions, no monolithic one.

just my two cents worth
dr.e

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

T-Steel — Sat, 08 Nov 2008 18:44:02 -0000

I've been saying for awhile that many of "The Right" and "The Left" just don't get the black community. Many black folks are social conservatives and fiscal liberals. They have much more in common with white evangelicals than white non-church goers. If it wasn't for black folks loyalty to the Democratic Party because of the past, we would be constant swing voters.

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

Ricorun — Sat, 08 Nov 2008 17:31:26 -0000

Whatever else could be said, I think this outcome demonstrates that "left" and "right" are not unitary concepts. We like to try to condense them onto a flat page, or even a dichotomy on a single line, but that's not reality. Reality is multi-dimensional, with lots of shades of gray -- which is itself a concept which applies only to a single dimension. It's technicolor in the extreme.

Let me also add that the individual dimensions that constitute the notion of "liberal" on the one hand or "conservative" on the other are not always orthogonal (i.e., independent) to each other. And even if they were they are not all equally potent at one time versus another in any one person's life. To think so robs reality of its true richness. And to build a coalition in such a way as to condense it into a dichotomy (which ultimately has to happen in any democratic, republic, or parliamentary system), one has to pay attention to all the details -- which variables are more important to which people and which are not; how do different variables relate to each other, and to what extent. Those are the kinds of things that cause the definition of "liberal" and conservative" to change over time -- and the coalitions that constitute each as well. Without properly identifying those things I argue that there could be no such thing as "soccer/hockey moms", or "security moms", or "Reagan Democrats", or "Obamacons".

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

Rambie — Sat, 08 Nov 2008 16:38:18 -0000

I was going to say, here in Utah, the Mormon Church is crying about being the scapegoat. So I guess the AA and Mormons will have to fight for who's the real scapegoat.

I didn't keep the article, but I read one where they interviewed a AA woman in LA who voted for Prop-8 on religious grounds. I thought it was ironic as not too many years ago there were segregationists using religion to justify their beliefs too.

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

EEllis — Sat, 08 Nov 2008 15:07:47 -0000

It's much more precise to blame the religious than just the Blacks. Since the AA community is very religious they can be lumped in there too. Don't forget the Mormons!!

Re: Stop Scapegoating Black People for Proposition 8

DLS — Sat, 08 Nov 2008 14:41:44 -0000

PC reconciliation is always touching.

The people have voted. If the law was _illegally_ passed (as is claimed by some in California), file a legitimate lawsuit. Lawsuits simply filed to try to get the law thrown out on by a judge's whim ought to be thrown out -- the lawsuits, that is, while the perps go to prison for it.