DISQUS

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Actually, my religious tradition teaches that you judge a man's or a woman's heart by how they live their lives. God may see the heart, but we human beings here on earth cannot see into people's hearts; we have to go by their deeds. By that measure, Ted Kennedy died with a lifetime of good work to his name, and one horrible act. I will let God worry about his heart, but I personally think it'll pass divine muster.

tidbits · 4 months ago

Thank you, dr. e for re-telling a history we should not forget, for reminding us that even Camelot had its sorcerers and secret chambers. Thank you as well for the wisdom to remind us that we do not know what happened on that bridge 40 years ago, and that we do not know what happened in the heart of the man in the decades that followed.

In the smash mouth world of our common politic, encouraged by the masters of inuendo, rumor, misdirection, obsfuscation, false assumptions and outright lies, we too often judge without knowing. Some will condemn - because they can. Others will laud - because they can. We see it from the right in judging Bill Clinton or Ted Kennedy. From the left we see the judgment visited on Mark Sanford or John Ensign.

Many of us have given in to the sins of lust and greed, known the temptations of arrogant power. Some have been called to task either truly or falsely. But, there is another truth found in the depth of your piece. Often the greatest lessons of life are learned in the contemplation of our errors. Some seek out those lessons. Others never learn. And, we do not, cannot, know who among us has truly learned and grown and who has not. We commonly speak a phrase in the face of sin, that he/she must "show remorse". In contemplating your article it occurs to me that remorse can perhaps be acted out like a scene from Hamlet, but whether remorse is true cannot be articulated or "shown"; it can only be known in the heart of the one whose remorse it is.

For myself, I believe I have learned this much: that I cannot judge the souls of others any more than I can allow my life to be driven by the judgments of others on my soul. To the man, who until yesterday walked among us, I pity your upbringing, but do not judge you as I mourn your passing. To those who, in life, would judge the souls of others, I am reminded of the wise adage, "There but for the grace of God..."

Thank you, dr. e, for giving me cause to think today.

kritt11 · 4 months ago

Thanks for the interesting background details- some I knew, some I had forgotten. I believe in looking at the worth of a person's life in total.

Ted Kennedy certainly struggled in his personal life, and this probably was the result of having such a rigid, overbearing father, who also set a terrible example for him. But, despite his flaws, Ted became the rock of the Kennedy family, in the same way that he was the rock of the Senate. His forty-seven years of public service, and his ability to work with the power-mongers from both parties, outweigh the character flaws of his earlier life.

Of course there will be many who negate his long career and faithfulness to his extended family with his behavior following Chappaquidick. In my mind, he was young and ambitious, and panicked when he was unable to get the young staffer out of that car. Yes, that was extreme negligence, but I have never equated it with murder, as many on the right have.

CStanley · 4 months ago

I never knew the backstory about Rosemary Kennedy either. What you wrote about sexual promiscuity (perhaps promiscuous, or perhaps just normal adolescent behavior that was unacceptable to her father) immediately led me to wonder about bipolar disorder. I probably shouldn't take on the role of armchair psychiatrist, but it sounded like a definite possibility for a young woman who is seen as wild and promiscuous...and then I clicked over to her wikipedia entry and there are other things noted, such as that she was 'hard for her family to handle' and that she showed signs of depression and then rages and erratic mood swings. All of those things are red flags for early onset bipolar disorder- which was not recognized at all during that era and is still often overlooked today.

Anyway- thank you, Dr. E., for the sensitive handling of this story. I know that many people will say that we shouldn't mention Chappaquidick at all today, but I've always felt that it's enormously disrespectful of the Kopechne family to sweep the story of their daughter's death under the rug.

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Dr. Clarissa Pinkola Estes, I am so glad and feel so honored to be the first to comment on this essay --one of the most beautiful, insightful, thoughtful, and loving that I have ever read. This is what taking responsibility really means in its truest, deepest, most honest sense -- us, we, me, you, everyone, taking responsibility for finding a way to understand the totality of a person's life, and the vast yet at the same time unseen and unknown (by most of us) context in which each human being makes the choices that each one of us does make in life.

I actually did not know that Rosemary Kennedy was lobotomized. I never, ever knew that. I, too, like so many others, just had heard all my life -- at whatever infrequent times I heard anything at all about her -- that she was retarded, brain damaged. I don't know if it was ever stated outright that it was congenital, but I just assumed it was.

I am as guilty as anyone else of judging people's actions -- especially when they are public figures which is when everything they do is in a fish bowl -- without knowing the forces that shaped them. Your article reminds me to at least be consciously aware when, inevitably, I find myself slipping into this habit, that I am drawing conclusions based on only a sliver of the truth.

colleenmontgomery · 4 months ago

Yes, Ted Kennedy may have done many good things for this world. However, the question that must be considered is the issues of his heart. In other words, his motive. Although, he talked about concern for the "poor" I question was he was mainly promoting his career?
The Holy Scriptures teach us that God looks upon the heart to see if any are searching for him. He promises to those that deligently seek him they will find him. The Ted Kennedy that I saw was one that deligently sought his own good and career.
I don't mean to criticize him I'm only concern about our young people seeing those that cheat on their wife, cheat at Harvard and who but God knows what else being idolized in the media. I never heard Ted Kennedy say that he was sorry for the hurt he caused others with his wild lifestyle.
I'm sorrry for his family for it is always a hard time to lose a loved one.
We need politicans that will lead the country in morality.

redbus · 4 months ago

There are some incredibly cruel comments on this thread. That's a shame. TMV is better than that.

Senator Kennedy had many flaws; so do I. He did what he felt was right. He was a courageous man, particularly in the end as he bravely fought his brain cancer.

May God give rest to his soul.

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

There are many things to be sad about today. The first of which is the fact that Mary Jo did not survive to see her 29th birthday. The second of which is the fact that Ted survived to see his 77th.

That is a disgusting thing to say. I'm sure there's a reason why you felt you had to say this about a human being -- any human being -- who just died of brain cancer, but I truly wish you had kept it to yourself.

ken1950 · 4 months ago

kathy,

I don't know what it is about you that wants to honor Ted...and you even somehow defend your support by raising Ted cause of death as brain cancer as being relevent. But since you use the manner of his death as your defense for supporting Ted's life....here we go... Ted drove Mary Jo off a bridge after a late night party...while he was intoxicated...this is a crime, DWI or DUI..., leaving the scene of an accident...also a crime, and more importantly...manslaughter of a young woman also a crime ....He killed Mary Jo by putting her in a situation that she was made to die very slowly...death by drowning while being trapped inside a car. Can you even begin to imagine her panic and the terror that she felt knowing she was about to die by slow suffocation...her seeing water rise up inside the car while she was helplessly trapped...her gulping in mouthfuls of water as she paniced while gasping for air...? Then after Ted freed himself and left her to die he swam away...away from the bridge, away from the nearby safety of the shore and away from Mary Jo... and somehow was able to swim the mile to the other shore...the shore where his home was.

All the next morning after hearing about the "accident" I kept waiting for some word, some reason, some new as to how this could unfortunate thing could have happened. Where was Ted? Then we finally got word...he and all the Kennedy boys were holed up at the compound along with their lawyers. The lawyers were contacted, but the Kennedys somehow could not contact the Police. The well rehearsed and concocted story about the "accident" was finally released about 12 hours after the Mary Jo died.

Does the manner and cause of death for Mary Jo make Kennedy better or worse for you? Yes? No? The fact that Ted died of a brain tumor is totally irrelevant to what he was about in life. He cheated in school, he cheated on his wife and he cheated Mary Jo out of her life. Since you have said that you are a religious person...What do you think was the discussion between God, Mary Jo, and Ted upon his arrival for his final judgement?

Let God do the judging for his soul...I will judge him for his lack of it.

Silhouette · 4 months ago

Yeah, I never forgot that girl he ditched for dead. Never. You don't forget things like that. Life deals out bitter ironies. People fail to notice that most of the time.

shaun · 4 months ago

I cried twice this morning. Once when I heard that Kennedy had died and then when I read this piece.

ordinarysparrow · 4 months ago

Dr. E. do you know any stories about Hydra?. . .

archangel · 3 months ago

dear Sparrow; hydra was once, like cerberus also a multi-body part being, protector of guardian of the gate to the underworld, keeping out mortals who were only curious or who merely wanted to exploit the powers there. In later mythos, hydra, became 'humanized' in the stories, carrying one immortal bloodline and all rest merely mortal... and in the decline to 'humanization' hydra was said to have poisonous blood, bite and breath. The hero who cut off the hydras' heads, cauterized them with the poison from the hydras own blood and thus felled the hydra. What hydra was meant to be, as guardian of respectful entry into underworld, devolved into hydra as human failings... the solution to which is to sever and poison such failings with the very poison leaking from them. A rather homeopathic remedy in some sense. Poison shot back to poison.

dr.e

roro80 · 4 months ago

This thread has gotten...ugly. I'm sorry, Dr. E, that your beautiful and nuanced piece has comments going in this direction.

JillyDybka · 4 months ago

They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.

So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her

candace12 · 4 months ago

I sat here and read some of the statements made. And I thought to myself, "what comments would be made at my death?" I didn't know Ted Kennedy. I knew his beliefs in politics and some were the same as mine. But all I'm going to say is this--Judge not that you be not judged. Rest in peace and the knowledge that you did what you thought was right, not that you were always right.

devilsadvocate87 · 4 months ago

I find it amazing to see the amount of people who were there to document Mary Jo's last moments on this earth. Did they sit by her side as she panicked and struggled for air? For all we know, in the pre mandatory seatbelt era, she could have been unconcious after hitting her head on the dash upon impact. Either way, it's nothing more than a sensationalist attempt to justify their disdain for a man they hold in contempt
With that being said, I am by no means belittling this tragedy. Should Ted have served time for what should have at least been negligent homicide if he was at fault...yes. Was his being born into a life of wealth and priveledge the mitigating factor in keeping him out of jail...yes. Hell, for all we know he might have wanted to turn himself him in but Ole' Joe threatened to have him lobotomized if he spoke one word that admitted any fault for that night.
That night will always be one of many dark stains in America's political history, but with the only other person who was in the car that night dead and gone, any speculation as to what happend that night in those cold waters is exactly that....speculation.

gallantKnight · 4 months ago

Thoughtful comment, with good ideas for thought.

ken1950 · 4 months ago

devilsadvocate,

Maybe the included link will help you to see where I am coming from when I talk about the "gasping for air" comment that I made...if she gasped for air (as was likely the case according to the medical examiner), she also had a chance to panic (or would you be the kind to go peacefully?) about the rising water around her and the gulping of that water as it rose above her mouth and nose as she struggled for what was left.

The article notes that Mary Jo was found in the back seat with her neck in a position that would suggest to the medical examiner that she was not only alive after the crash but she was most likely in a pocket of air in the rear of the car (the front of the car is heavier than the rear and the rear is buoyed by the air pocket). Visualize your own daughter or son in her place as each last bubble left the car her pocket of life giving air diminished. What did not diminish was her terror. How long did she live in terror? Kennedy could have cared less,...he was only into saving his own miserable hide.

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=8212665

BTW, no one is saying that the bridge wasn't a problem driving over...how easily anyone could have had an accident... All the more horrible that Ted chose to get into a car, after heavy drinking (how many times has he been caught for drunk driving). It was not the narrow bridge that caused him to leave the scene. It was not the narrow bridge that made he, his brothers and his legal counsel concoct a well scripted story for the publics consumption 12 hours after the accident. It was Ted.

maxpower999999 · 4 months ago

So he intentionally left her there, caring less about her living in terror, trapped in the car. Then you mention heavy drinking, so he must have been pretty drunk then. How rational and coherent to you generally find drunk people to be?

And to those of you deciding what law(s) was/were broken, I had no idea Hollywood Upstairs Medical College also had a law school.

ckc61 · 4 months ago

DUH! He rational enough to get himself out...Oh.. I am sorry.. He was drunk...so that makes it ok.
It was not his fault.
Lets blame the beer!! No that would make all the beer drinkers responsible.

By his own actions he judged himself.

maxpower999999
"And to those of you deciding what law(s) was/were broken, I had no idea Hollywood Upstairs Medical College also had a law school."

Read the paper, watch the news, When there is an accident, a death as a result, driver leaving scene, drunk. Manslaughter, Murder, are the charges you see among others.
No not law school, common sense and paying attention.
Learn a lot from a dummy as the comercial says.
Dont drink and drive!

devilsadvocate87 · 3 months ago

Thank you for providing me with information that I was not aware of prior to my post. I based my assumptions, like most here did, without many details to the event, just heresay and speculation. If those were indeed the details in the medical examiners record then the likelyhood of her struggling to survive are pretty high. However, I didn't select the name "devilsadvocate87" to complacentely agree so allow me to present this scenario. If she was unconciuous and unbuckled in the front seat, as I threw out as a "possiblity", when the car sank nose first and the murky waters filled the cab couldn't her own bouyancy float her from the front seat to the back? A bouyant object will float toward the surface and in this case the "surface" was located in the rear of the Oldsmobile's cabin.
  Once again, I am not Democrat or Republican nor am I conservative or liberal. I honestly think the Senator should have served time solely based on the admission of heavy drinking being a contributing factor to this accident. If anyone else was drinking and driving and had been involved in an accident that resulted in the death of another human being, they would be locked up. However, even that admission may not have been enough to warrant a stiff sentence as some of the laws and penalties of the day were  very different and in some instances a mere slap on the wrist by comparison to todays standards, especially as it pertained to the wealthy and priveledged.
  I bear no ill will towards the man, nor do I hold him in high esteem as some here do. Furthermore, I have to agree with your statement had this been one of my four daughters I might not be so open-minded, but the fact that it wasn't allows me some room to be objective and not let emotion cloud my thought process to the different possibilities surrounding the circumstances of her last few moments. Perhaps one of my possibilities may have occured that dark cold night and maybe, just maybe, God let this unfortunate soul enter in to his eternal kingdom blissfully unaware of her passing. We can only hope...just a thought.

________________________________

ztownric · 3 months ago

couldn't agree more...bravo!

ckc61 · 4 months ago

Vehicular manslaughter. This is the very least you or I would be charged with, if that is it was reported right away. Otherwise Vehicular Homicide or Murder.... That is if you could not BUY or Bully your way out of it! Yes, we all have flaws, Now when was the last time you left someone for dead?? I was not there , no but there is no way I believe I would have gotten off scott free. Power corrupts; absolute power corrupts absolutely. As to laying the blame on his father..All MEN are responsible for thier OWN actions. I am so tired of people blaming others for thier faults!
I know personally of what I speak. I do not do the things my father did. I take full responsiblity for my actions. I try to instill that to my own kids, in words and deed.
Judging someone else....No ... He judged himself on that night....Now it is up to God to judge him.
But I just wonder what Mary Jo's family is thinking... Just a thought,,,Why are no reporters asking them?? If they are I have not seen it. Its all about the Kennedys.
Sad all the way around.
His good deeds... Well his did learn from an expert on covering up.

archangel · 4 months ago

dear CKC61,

You wrote: "But I just wonder what Mary Jo's family is thinking... Just a thought,,,Why are no reporters asking them?? If they are I have not seen it."

Miss Kopechne was an only child, adding to the tragedy of her death for her folks. There are no nieces, nephews, brothers, sisters, in-laws. Her folks passed from this world some time ago. Had they lived to today, they'd be in their late 80 or early 90s now. May they all rest in peace. All.

Thanks for your comment CKC.

Dr.E

ckc61 · 4 months ago

Thank you Dr.E. I was not aware of that. On the news ...All the talk of a "great Leagacy" at an end.
The Kopechne's legacy ended years ago. Poetic Justice some would say. I for one.

roro80 · 4 months ago

Dr. E, I love the kaleidascope metaphor. It describes so well the divide, the complication that so many feel about Ted Kennedy. One of the other ways I've seen him described today I also thought was apt: he was a strong man born into the highest echelons of priviledge, and he weilded that priviledge both for good and for ill. He left Miss Kopechne for dead without punishment, and he also used his power to loudly defend his nephew, William K. Smith, from charges of rape; he did this by heading up a smear campaign against the victim. On the other hand, he genuinely cared for the downtrodden in the world and in our country, and tried to enact legislation to benefit them, to the betterment of society as a whole. He fought tirelessly so that women would be able to excersize their right to choose. He seemed to truly recognize that the priviledge into which he was born was not shared by those of different social classes, different races, different genders, or different orientations; he used his own priviledge and power to try and shrink that gap. He was an excellent Senator.

I guess it's not for us to say whether the good outweighs the ill, or vice versa; the recognition that both existed within this man may allow us to recognize similar shades of grey within ourselves.

DLS · 4 months ago

"But, despite his flaws, Ted [...]"

had, and earned, more respect than, say, Newt Gingrich.

mikehunt1 · 4 months ago

All I am saying is he should be respected for everything he did good for this country but when writing a biographical piece, you cannot leave out one of the most important moment in his life whether the major news organizations want to or not?

jbrown2009 · 3 months ago

Good?

aficionadaa · 4 months ago

Dear Clarissa,
Thank you for this text : as I saw the new today, I was listening to journalists who seemed to be so sad about Ted Kennedy (and so I was).
They told the accident with the young woman, which I didn't know. And the only thing I was thinking of was this woman :" for most people she's just the little problem which explains that he did not succed in his political career... what was thinking her family when she died ? How could it be possible that a human being dies and everybody knows it and no one cares because it is ted kennedy, it is long ago ?"
I was so sad about it that I thought I was asking myself : am I OK ? am I depressed ?
So, I wrote this mail not to talk about me, but to thank you Dr. E : everytime I'm reading your textes I'm thinking : I'm not a fool, they are others people who are shocked, and they are not "angry" people, but normal people...
(Sorry for my english : I'm french)

ordinarysparrow · 4 months ago

Father Time. . . please re-read these two paragraphs. . .

"Every person’s life is like a kaleidoscope. Some pick up another’s life, hold it to the light and all the glass chips fall this way or that. And the person sighting through the cylinder puts it down and turns away, saying they’ve seen it all, when in fact, they’ve only seen one facet, one pattern in another’s life. Thus some remember only one thing or two about the life of another long lived.

But there are other ways to see most of a life in depth, that is, to keep turning the kaleidoscope, letting the glass shards open and reveal, shade and hide, depending on the turn of the scope. Adding up all the patterns, keeping the sum of the brilliant and the dark turns: that’s a view in depth of the life of another.

I’d just lay out a few turns of the kaleidoscope of Ted Kennedy’s life here, a lost story:"

and once you have comprehended the above. . .perhaps you would like to go to another post of Dr.E's concerning Senator Kennedy. . . i will supply the link. . .

http://themoderatevoice.com/19791/senator-kenne...

Father Time now you have at least two different frames. . .



May you find peace too Father Time

mariaycorazon · 3 months ago

I find this whole conversation here very disturbing. I guess many of the people commenting on this stream are qualified to be the judge and jury of other people's transgressions. Not only are some expert in our judicial system and its failings they are also qualified to play God and to condemn others to hell. I think the comments posted here say more about the people making the comments than they do about Senator Kennedy. May he rest in peace and God bless him for a lifetime devoted to the redemption of his human frailties, sins, crimes, and everything else he may have committed.

Ghostdreams · 4 months ago

autocompanydude

Frankly, I thought Doc Estes was quite honourable and kind about the whole thing.
Now if *I* were the one writing a post about Ted Kennedy, that would be ugly.
The Doc's post though, is pretty darn nice (especially considering who we're talking about here).

Ghost

PS For those of us who were alive at that time of Chappaquiddick and remember the scam, the cover, the poor girl left for dead....Some of us just don't carry that, "hope you're doin well" attitude towards Ted.
Forgive us our transgression of being a little peeved at the lack of justice from a bygone era, eh?

Polimom · 4 months ago

Ah. I see the ghoulies and ghosties have begun crawling about the comments thread now.

Someone should have shot him too.

How special. Thanks so much for taking time from your busy subterranean life to visit with us here. I'd caution you about that free-swinging door near the exit, but... well... I'm actually kind of looking forward to the back-end contact.

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Ken,

It sounds from the way you wrote this that you are a relative or friend of the Kopechne family. If that is so, I can understand much better why you feel the way you do. If you are personally involved, please forgive me for causing you any pain. I didn't mean to.

JSpencer · 4 months ago

Thanks for another insightful and thought provoking post Dr. E. The story about Rosemary is a terrible one, as tragic as the fate of Mary Jo Kopechne. That both women suffered as the result of bad judgement, or worse at the hands of Kennedy men is a dark cloud over that legacy. Credit cannot be withheld from Edward Kennedy though, who spent most of his life in service to his country.

It’s said too that one receives credit for learning on earth from one’s abject suffering, no matter what crassness or separation from the God of Life and Love, preceded it.

I truly hope this is the case...

Ghostdreams · 4 months ago

From Wikipedia:
According to Kessler, Dr. Brown called the suppression of the truth "the biggest mental health cover-up in history". Since the "public story" is still that Rosemary was retarded, the "lack of support for mental illness is part of a total lifelong family denial of what was really so. … Some of us knew the secret and kept it secret.

This is awful and pathetic (although, in my opinion the mentally ill are still suffering horribly at the hands of this society - something that needs to change STAT).
It reminds me of what happened to Francis Farmer and the sister of Tennessee Williams (whose name, co-incidentally, was also Rose). It also makes me wonder just how many innocents suffered such a fate due to bad psychiatric practices.
What an ungodly thing to do to a person! :(
As for Ted Kennedy....well....considering some of the things he did in his life that he never paid any type of restitution for ...
I'll just leave it at, RIP Ted.

Thanks for the informative article Doc!
Ghost

billbe · 4 months ago

How can facts with passion be cruel??

Leonidas · 4 months ago

He did what he felt was right. He was a courageous man

Not always as the Chappaquiddick incident makes painfully obvious, but perhaps at least he partially made up for his actions there in his later life. People can change. But thats for God to judge.

john123321 · 4 months ago

Ahh... Finally, we can move on. I'm fifty years old, a political moderate, and I remember the day (as a child) that JFK was shot. Over the years, I have decided for my own peace of mind that JFK's murder was at the least facilitated by the politics of the Pentagon, and that truth was concealed from the public by the Warren Commission. Certainly, Father Joseph was a horrible man, and a miserable example of fatherhood. JFK was thus fundamentally flawed. Some choose to view his various indiscretions as "human". Bobby never really got started (although portions of "his" 1968 Gun Control Act were purportedly lifted directly from Hitler's Gun Control Act), and then there was Ted. Well, he was something the tabloids just had to love. I almost felt a sense of relief when I realized that John Jr would not become a political chesspiece. They are gone now. Game over, time to set up the next one.

DLS · 4 months ago

Of course Chappaquiddick and other blemishes on Teddy K. are appropriate, especially given how Teddy K. has been already exploited by the far Left as another emotional appeal (sympathy) for their failing health care effort. (No, Chris Matthews, you sap, Obama is not the last Kennedy brother now.)

Chappaquiddick permanently tainted Kennedy and was simply one of many Kennedy family instances of behavior that exhibited an attitude that the normal rules of society or of nature don't apply to them; they're special and can violate them at will. (Hence the airplane crash of another Kennedy.)

Chappaquiddick did not sink Kennedy, as he, warts and all, remained a preeminent Democrat in the 1970s and 1980s. It was not only Chappaquiddick but Carter and public rejection of liberalism (which Kennedy compounded by going far left in the 1980s) that kept Ted Kennedy out of the White House.

He lived life quite well, and can now swap party tales with Frank Sinatra and Elvis Presley.

** Traveler's note: For a positive view of all the Kennedys, a visit to the (John F.) Kennedy library in Massachusetts cannot be surpassed. When I was there, I saw in particularly the whole-family portrait of beautiful, smiling people, and thought -- the Kennedy critics must be jealous of that.

(Already: "In remembrance of Senator Edward M. Kennedy, the John F. Kennedy Presidential Library will have condolence books available for the public to sign during normal Museum operating hours, 9am – 5pm.")

http://www.jfklibrary.org/

T-Steel · 4 months ago

And the debate of Chappaquiddick begins. Where's my Pepto Bismol?? MEDIC!!!

ordinarysparrow · 4 months ago

Dr. E. . . .thanks for this depth and insight. . . .like Kathy there was much i did not know. . .when i heard of Senator Kennedy's passing have laid awake all night thinking of his life and the fullness with it's light and dark and many shades of gray. . .a passing of something bigger than one man. . . .my heart feels sad. . .

one of my favorite memories was when he and Arlin Specter (?). . .where bellowing at each other in the Senate one day and Nina Totenberg on npr described them as two old bulls of the Senate going after each other. . . loved the imagery. . .

ragzamuffin · 3 months ago

One thing of note about JFK and Senator Kennedy is that despite their wealth and despite being raised by a power monger father they were both Democrats and championed the disadvantaged. This is not the same as a yearly donation to a charity but a lifetime of work at least in the Senator's case. Perhaps they both were driven to ameliorate the sins of the father at least in business. As for their treatment of women it's strange that they did somehow avenge the treatment of their sister Rosemary. Or did they and I don't know what it was. Like "Rachel" said about burning in hell..I think that is best left to the divine. San

skepticgriggsy · 3 months ago

Sen. Kennedy's justified position as a moral leader will forever exhume his role in the Senate. Pres. Obama with V.P. Biden and Sec'y. Sebellius will attain the health plan named after him. His self-admitted shame hangs over his legacy. As Dr. Albert Ellis observes in " The Myth of Self-Esteem," most of us are not great heroes nor great villains.. Read this book and also Dr. Robert Price's " The Reason- Driven Life," to fathom how to be a better you! The senator was no hater as Ellis would so commend and he followed reason in his politics and sometimes in his personal life. He, on the whole , was a worthy role model. May his detractors practice perspective!

Rachel_Snyder · 3 months ago

I can understand why many of the people posting on here have such a negative view of the late Senator. Personally, I feel that he did a lot of good in his life, but am not convinced that that "makes up" for the death of a young woman, or if anything ever could. I guess I take the view that he did some things that were better, and at least one thing that was far worse, than anything most of us will ever do, but I can understand why others may not share that view. What I cannot understand is how anyone with an ounce of decency (or for that matter, sanity) can declare definitively that someone had no soul, or that they hope another human being is "burning in hell."

gallantKnight · 4 months ago

Wait a minute, Ted didn’t just have an affair and cheat on his wife; a woman needlessly died, and the person responsible paid for it how? Ah ha, Dr. E, you’ve shaken the minds of so many today. You’ve poured a mixture of bootlegged whiskey into the minds of many, and shaken then stirred it to perfection.

Perhaps today of all days, we should remember not just the good, but we should also remember the bad. None of the good things Ted Kennedy did can erase the one terrible thing we know about. Nor can all of the good things Ted Kennedy did erase the horrifying lives the Kennedy family endured at the hand of the father. It seems that many good things come after terrible tragedies befall innocent or not so innocent people. Perhaps the measure of a person is what they do with their lives in spite of or because of the trials of their lives. How can any of us judge the indiscretions of others, when we have plenty enough of our own; however we have the responsibility to temper our praise with raw reality. Indeed if many people hadn’t considered the reality along with the praise for oh so many years, Ted Kennedy would probably have been one of our presidents.

Alas, I cannot help but ask, “If I were driving that car, and waited until the next day to report the accident, what would have happened to me?” I don’t have an overwhelming grief resulting from Ted Kennedy’s passing, but I do have great sympathy for his surviving family. I also have a sincere hope…I hope he has had the opportunity to apologize, face to face, to Mary Jo Kopechene and she had the opportunity to forgive him.

When I asked my tenth grade classes about Ted Kennedy, they barely knew who he was. They never heard of Mary Jo Kopechene, and the Chappaquiddick Bridge was a meaningless bridge who knows where? Some of us remember very well as if the events happened less than a week ago, and it seems that many of us are still asking the same questions, “Why did he leave her there and not go for help?” and “Why isn’t he just now getting out of jail?”

How can we measure the good with the bad? We can’t.

Thank you ArchAngel, for showing us that there is thought and passion still in our hearts, and we still live in sight of justice.

anti_kennedy09 · 4 months ago

I hope that Ted Kennedy is burning in hell as I type this. He is the only Kennedy that lived long enough to get caught for all of the wretched and horrible evils that he has done. He lived a life without consequences and give a shi* less for others or what happened to them. I don't buy into all of his BS that he said as a politician--none of that is ever meant out of sincerity--only meant to gather votes--and he did in Massachusetts since 1962. Ted Kennedy was the spawn of the devil himself (aka Joe Sr) and so were his older brothers (Joe Jr, Jack and Bobby)--they just never lived long enough to be found out.

lutherdavis · 3 months ago

don't forget about JFK, BOBBY, and Schrivers visit to Marilyn Monroe very shortly before her death !!!!

mikec45 · 4 months ago

Ted was a womanizing partying drunk.Shed not atear for him.He shed none for Mary JO.He got away with murder because of his name.What goes around comes around.

mike17 · 4 months ago

Ahhhh. the good old days when the extremely wealthy could kill someone in a DUI situation, dis-appear for 48 hours so he has enough time to sober up, and get an alibi from high powered attorneys, and suffer no conciquences for his actions. While poor Marys family is left with nothing but grief and un-answered questions. Someone should have shot him too.

jim300 · 4 months ago

Have to wonder if the souls of the unborn who are in heaven demand justice from the one who condoned their brutal deaths his whole political career...

thewizardtim · 4 months ago

thankyoujim

autocompanydude · 4 months ago

It's hard to imagine a more universal sanctimoniously hateful, uncharitable diatribe, written as if only the writer knows the truth, and anything that varies from this spiteful rendition would be the product of fools, or those purposely mis-representing the truth. The author clearly never lets the facts get in the way of seeing things as he imagines them to be, or to have been, so he might best be able to push his own hateful agenda. By the way, if you ever saw the bridge involved, on a dark night, it's not hard to imagine someone driving over the side inadvertently. And confusion at the time of such an incident would not be uncommon, even for those you would not normally expect it of. But then, why bother with such realities, right Ms. Estes?

scfranklin94 · 4 months ago

Unfortunately lobotomies were considered a type of treatment for behavioral problems back in the late 1930's and throughout the 1940's. H.L. Hunt of Hunt Oil had his eldest child, Hassie, lobotomized when it was thought that he had schizophrenia (he may have been bipolar like Rosemary). This is not to excuse Joseph Kennedy's other actions, but I think what happened to Rosemary needs to be viewed in the context of the times.

As for Ted Kennedy, all I'll say is that if anyone else left someone to slowly drown in a car accident, they would've served some hard time in the state pen.

Father_Time · 4 months ago

She died in a car accident.

Every car accident death can be dramatized into anything you want it to imply if you wish to imply something remarkable. Oh that shadow of doubt, oh that imperfect family, oh the story the sensational story.

Judging others requires no courage at all. Convicting other people’s character based on incomplete facts and hearsay is completely void of integrity.

A great man died today. A member of a great family, that gave us probably more than any single family in American history, imperfect as they may be, died today.

You left out so many very pertinent facts that you should be ashamed.

cvl · 4 months ago

The Kennedy men have a long and destructive history. News media, friends, family have covered their brutal tracks. God knows the truth and He is the ultimate and PERFECT judge. God ALWAYS has the last word.

mikehunt1 · 4 months ago

He didn't report an accident until the next day, this is not sensational, this is factual. Ever think about WHY he would not report it? What if she could've been saved if the police were notified? Ever think of that Father Time?

thewizardtim · 4 months ago

And so you judge just as you despise the others for doing.

jebboyd · 4 months ago

Wow! So that whole thing of not bothering to report it 'til the next day just goes right on by? His responsibility in your mind is reduced to, "She died in a car wreck, it is what it is." You're a real piece of work! I guess you'd look her parents in the eye and say the same? Of course, his famous drunkennesss and womanizing would just be a "Boys will be boys" thing to you, huh?

That's no leader or role model.....just another shanty Irish bum.

Janna · 4 months ago

the Kennedy clan was headed by a greedy, power hungry, womanizing, drunken, loud mouthed Nazi sympathizer boor who was so unsure of himself he had to buy and bully to get his way. This is the Kennedy legacy. It is a generational problem in that family. God have mercy on Ted Kennedy's soul.

RobertCapeCanaveral · 4 months ago

Point of fact: It was Herbert Walker and Prescot Bush who had several companies seized by the US government for continuing to do business with Nazi Germany AFTER we declared war in December 1941.

DISQUS_anna · 4 months ago

Speaking of SHAME: A young girl was killed in vehicular manslaughter. He was not a great man, he was born into a family run by a mobster. Where do Americans get their values? A great man would have fessed up immediately. He did not. He was a cheating coward to the end. He played the name game. Without his name, he'd be nothing. Get a GRIP, father_time et al. You ignore the only fact that counts: a young girl was killed, and without the Kennedy name he'd be in JAIL. He isn't the only Kennedy that played that name to his advantage - there is a serial rapist in that family who skated free. Not to mention Martha Moxley the truth of which seems to be ever elusive when it comes to a Kennedy alleged perp. You should also be aware of the family tree of his current wife, which is more in tune with what his father was. THESE are the facts, but many cannot handle the truth.

fitzy06 · 4 months ago

Wrong. She died in a car accident of a drunken, over priveledged, snot nosed piece of ... who was too cowardly to try to save anyone but himself. He is NOT a great American, he is the youngest son of a piece of ... He has not served his country, and he does NOT deserve to be buried in Arlington, next to so many true and great Americans. I can understand JFK being buried there, he actually served his country not only as Commander in Chief, but was in harm's way during WWII. Bobby? Did he ever serve? I don't know, and won't look it up here, but if not, he should not be buried in Arlington either......Ted Kennedy being buried in Arlington National Cemetary is an absolute DISGRACE to real Americans who have actually served their country and given the ultimate sacrifice for their country. Ted Kennedy was a piece of ...

nycdavid · 4 months ago

Not a big fan of Ted Kennedy's but he is entitled to be buried at Arlington, both due to his time in the military and his time in Congress.

baysailor · 4 months ago

Bobby served in the Navy like his 2 older brothers. Ted was in the Army. Perhaps Bob and Ted were never in harm's way in a combat zone as were Joe and Jack, but they served. Ted's 47 years' service to his country in Congress should count for something, regardless of how we feel about his political beliefs. Today, how many big-shot CEOs, or for that matter, Congresscritters, have children in the military? Not many. Ted could have loaded through life, living off his trust fund. Instead, he chose public service. The Kennedys were flawed people, but they genuinely cared about the little guy. That's what I choose to remember about them.

blarghyous · 4 months ago

I believe he served a short time, his father got him into color gaurd duty in Paris...such a touch assignment...

jeanLorelle · 3 months ago

...a bit like George W's awall.

ztownric · 3 months ago

Arlington used to be the estate of Robert E. Lee prior to the Civil War. NOT just war veterans and those who died in combat are buried there. Section 21, also known as the Nurses Section, is the area of Arlington National Cemetery where many nurses are buried. The Nurses Memorial is located there. In the cemetery, there is a Confederate section with graves of soldiers of the Confederate States of America and a Confederate Memorial. In Section 27, there are buried more than 3,800 former slaves, called "Contrabands" during the Civil War. Their headstones are designated with the word "Civilian" or "Citizen". btw... for the "disgrace" statement, that would be untrue. Arlington is to be a memorial for those now dead who served this nation. Ted did serve this nation, both in the Army and in the U.S. Senate, so his burial in Arlington would be appropriate.

fitzy06 · 3 months ago

Ok, after reflection and cooler headed thinking, I agree....I allowed my political views, which are a complete 180 from Ted's to interfere with my thinking.....plus, I think, a wee nip or two too much of Makers Mark last night......I hereby back off and stand corrected.....




________________________________

ztownric · 3 months ago

Makers Mark...fine selection indeed...wish I had been there to enjoy the toast.

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Ouch! Well, I *was* the first when I started writing my comment! I swear it!

ulee · 4 months ago

janna--you are so right. you know public policy and you know ted. god bless you.

Father_Time · 4 months ago

ordinarysparrow--

This sort of narrative is difficult for me to follow. To much fluff for my taste. I’m more of a Hemingway/Fitzgerald type of old fart. Besides, I’m suspicious of Magyar intentions. They have killed off ALL the Avars without good reason.

thegodsandthekennedys · 4 months ago

It was very sad when John Kennedy Jr. died.
But I was amazed at the thoughtlessness of the Kennedy family to schedule a wedding (Rory Kennedy-Bailey) on the same weekend as the anniversary of the death of Mary Jo Kopechne

davidbarrell · 4 months ago

I believe the appropriate description of Ted Kennedy's actions and non-actions that tragic night at Chappaquidick would be NEGLIGENT HOMICIDE. There is not one person on Martha's Vinyard that believes Kennedy's story about repeated diving into the water to save the unfortunate Mary Jo. Johnny Weissmuller couldn not have negotiated those currents. Total calculated negligence -- save ME first.
Goodby Ted. Mary Jo would have been 68 today.

Disgusted in Vermont

ken1950 · 4 months ago

There are many things to be sad about today. The first of which is the fact that Mary Jo did not survive to see her 29th birthday. The second of which is the fact that Ted survived to see his 77th.

thewizardtim · 4 months ago

leonidas? you take the name of a lionheart and espouse the squeakings of the mouse

thewizardtim · 4 months ago

ken1950 here here and well spoken my good man.when surrounded by brigands one lays about one with a sturdy staff until none are left standing.you speak well and swing a goodly blow to the squeakers

sundayweiss · 4 months ago

I am not going to think Politics will be less fortunate without a Kennedy male in the White House, but it sure would be nice to see Maria Shriver as California's Gov. I don't know about how the Kopechne family feels with Ted Kennedys passing, but I am glad the chapter of Kennedy's in the White House is closed.

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Have to wonder if the souls of the unborn who are in heaven demand justice from the one who condoned their brutal deaths his whole political career...

"The unborn"? What is that? I didn't know you could be a you if you haven't been born. What's the "you"? How can a "you" be a "you" if nothing has been born?

I am confused....

kathykattenburg · 4 months ago

Ted Kennedy was a piece of ...

Where is Jason when you need him?

Martel676 · 4 months ago

Ironically, T Kennedy had a longer and more prolific political career than either of his two famous brothers. I imagine he believed in what he was doing and must have done some things we could judge as being worthwhile. Then again, practically all politicians are self-seeking and corrupt. TK probably could follow his heart more than other politicians because he was guaranteed a lifelong seat just because he was a Kennedy.

My greatest objection to him was that he symbolized the very thing that the Democrats claim to be against - privilege. Far from being the mythical common man, TK was from the ultimate in American families and literally got away with murder. Would any of us little people have walked away from that tragedy unscathed like Ted? At the very least, I would have expected his political career to be over, but he kept that and stayed out of prison too.

I did not respect him and was never fooled into thinking he was some kind of grand statesman. He wasn't. I am happy to finally be rid of the far left and poisonous influence of the Kennedy family in national politics. This was one dysfunctional family and simply not worthy of the adulation from the American public. In fact, there are plenty of examples of odious Kennedy's romping across the scene - just Google the family and you'll find all kinds of bad behavior.

I don't believe in a personal God or Heaven or Hell. But if there is an afterlife, and some sort of reckoning, then I hope Mary Jo is kicking Ted's ass or just leaving him locked in a car in the water under a bridge for eternity.

fitzy06 · 3 months ago

"I did not respect him and was never fooled into thinking he was some kind of grand statesman. He wasn't. I am happy to finally be rid of the far left and poisonous influence of the Kennedy family in national politics. This was one dysfunctional family and simply not worthy of the adulation from the American public. In fact, there are plenty of examples of odious Kennedy's romping across the scene - just Google the family and you'll find all kinds of bad behavior."

I've quoted the meat and potatoes of what I agree with most in your post. VERY well said sir, and may vigilant Americans now focus their eyes on the likes of the horrid, leftist surrenderist appeasing cowards, with the same effite, elitist arrogance that the afforementioned Kennedy person had: To wit: Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid. Disgusting disgraces and ...of politics and public policy.

texthemerciless · 4 months ago

Hearing of this pond scums death made my freaking day.
The fondest memory I have of him was hearing of his seizure at the DNC.
Burn you ...!!!!!!!!

rarce · 4 months ago

You guys need to do a bit more checking. As I remember from an article from the time, that wasn't a 'bridge'; it was a pier. Part of the cover-up was calling it a bridge to make it look reasonable for him to be driving on it but it doesn't go to the other side. Take a good look at the picture. Why was he driving on it? Apparently he had been parked on some quiet road, presumably for R&R with Miss Mary Jo, was interrupted by a passing car and had taken off. The author theorized that in his panic to avoid scandal he made a mistake and drove onto the pier, lost control and went off the side. From the way the car landed in the water on its side (as determined by the damage to the car) and where it was found it was going too fast. Quite telling is that, as previously noted, he didn't swim to the adjacent shore with the pier but made a LONG swim to the other side, where his house happened to be. Extremely doubtful he ever tried to reach Mary. Showed up at the house soaking wet. A very juicy story, nicely suppressed.

ztownric · 4 months ago

Yes, I agree with MORE checking....First, everyone here seems to be a little bit preoccupied with what they know as "facts"...the diver that pulled her body from the wreckage said "she was too buoyant to be full of water"...and the funeral director said "cause of death was suffocation, not drowning"...so the fabrication of the "facts" seem to be presented from the onset of this tragedy. The autopsy was prevented by her parents AFTER the Kennedy family and friends MET with them and "explained the tragedy".. although; Ted never told them he was driving the vehicle, which her mother pointed out later, and after 500k from the insurance company and 90k+ from Ted himself, the whole incident was "laid to rest". What appears to be the "story" is that several married men are partying with a group of single women at a vacation resort...Ted offered a ride to one of the ladies to take her back to her hotel...he turned down a dirt road by mistake and drove off the pier (being a resident to the neighborhood for over 30 years not knowing the area) ... and then pulled his 6'2 stocky-build body out of his Oldsmobile and "left" Mary Jo in the car (she was 5'2 and thin built, and could have easily gotten out if conscious)...diving in many more times after the fact (guess he couldn't find her in the vehicle)....and then took a nice long swim... took over 10 hours to alert the authorities...and went back to HIS hotel room afterwards..I wasn't there, so I can't say what the actual "facts" are...but all this seems a little..Um..suspicious...

ken1950 · 4 months ago

"...and the funeral director said "cause of death was suffocation, not drowning..."

I do not have any fact to dispute this statement, but if it is true....all the more horrific it must have been for Mary Jo to die the lingering suffocation that she endured. To "suffocate" underwater without drowning can only happen one way. She found a pocket of air, and for many long minutes...30?....40?...she struggled to gasp for air....finally after a very long time with her neck in an upright position in the rear portion of the car (which is the position that the divers found her in)....she "suffocated" in the oxygen depleted pocket of air....

Yes, how long did she live in terror while the good Kennedy chose to swim the mile AWAY from the scene of the crime to the safety of his room? How long on his swim back was Mary Jo in abject terror while he was trying to swim to his escape?

Yes! This is how I remember Ted (the humanitarian) Kennedy...and THIS it is how I will continue to choose to remember him. I will not conveniently change history by remembering only the portions that he and his attorneys have scripted for me to remember.

ken1950 · 4 months ago

For those who choose to do a little more fact checking before posting, I might suggest this as what seems to be a fairly well documented (sources cited) summation of the incident.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chappaquiddick_inc...

The same questions arise and the same chill runs up my spine as it did 40 years ago when I read this summary.

ztownric · 3 months ago

OK KEN...guess you looked up one article..made a personal memory recall..and then decided to try and discredit any information that I have posted...put the vodka and tonic down for a minute and read the "well documented" accounts of the incident...(I am assuming...you were not there at the scene either.)

There were also doubts about the way Kopechne died. Dr. Donald Mills of Edgartown, wrote on the death certificate: "death by drowning". However, Gene Frieh, the undertaker, told reporters that death "was due to suffocation rather than drowning". John Farrar, the diver who removed Kopechne from the car, claimed she was "too buoyant to be full of water". It is assumed that she died from drowning, although her parents filed a petition preventing an autopsy.

Here is your wiki findings....informative but not complete...

The medical examiner, Dr Donald Mills, was satisfied that the cause of death was accidental drowning. He signed a death certificate to that effect and released Kopechne's body to her family without ordering an autopsy.[24] Later, on September 18, District Attorney Dinis attempted to secure an exhumation of Kopechne's body in order to perform a belated autopsy,[25] citing blood found on Kopechne's skirt and in her mouth and nose "which may or may not be consistent with death by drowning".[26] The reported discovery of the blood was made when her clothes were turned over to authorities by the funeral director.[27]

A Pennsylvania court under Judge Bernard Brominski held a hearing on the request on October 20–21.[25] The request was opposed by Kopechne's parents.[25] Eventually Judge Brominski ruled against the exhumation on December 10, saying that there was "no evidence" that "anything other than drowning had caused the death of Mary Jo Kopechne".[28]


Furthermore...
Here is some MORE checking for you KEN....in case you are too busy making judgment on others statements WITHOUT researching for yourself...

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=cP0NAAAAIB...

http://www.boston.com/news/specials/kennedy/day...

if you would like additional "well documented" items, let me know...I'll provide them for you...

ken1950 · 3 months ago

Actually, I was agreeing with you that some verification of the "facts"
needs to be done. That is why I posted the link...as I knew it made mention
of a lot of conflicting information which was in conflict with some of the
reports that I had read prior to posting.

ztownric · 3 months ago

I can relate to conflicting reports, and in this case...it appears all the parties involved with the incident are intentionally making it so. It is sad that a young woman in her prime had to lose her life in the ordeal, and no matter what the actual facts are...that will not change. btw...I do have a tendency to be a little heated (and some humor with sarcasm) with my thoughts, so hope no offense was taken...none was meant.

endorn · 4 months ago

Hmmm, the good Doctor is on point. The senator also was driving without a license - it had been revoked due to negligent behavior relative to the carbon fraction a year prior to the Mary Jo incident. The lack of licensure was quickly rectified in the middle of the night and produced by morning; so the main ingredient for a felony charge was erased.

rarce · 4 months ago

You're right. I had forgotten that point about the revoked license but recall it now. Probably part of the reason for the panic. Especially if he had been drinking at the earlier party. And I'm sure he had, he was a Kennedy, after all. Would have completely destroyed his political ambitions if the reporters hadn't cooperated so well or if the local officials hadn't been so useful.

billbe · 4 months ago

"That's what I choose to remember about them."

And that folks is how you change history. Well said baysailor and very well done.

ztownric · 3 months ago

As for some theories...this one probably makes the most sense of all....at least in my opinion.

Here is what happened according to Robert Cutler's (You the Jury - 1974) analysis of the evidence. The Group ( a political power group explained in the book) hired several men and at least one woman to be at Chappaquiddick during the weekend of the yacht race and the planned party on the island. They ambushed Ted and Mary Jo after they left the cottage and knocked Ted out with blows to his head and body. They took the unconscious or semi-conscious Kennedy to Martha's Vineyard and deposited him in his hotel room. Another group took Mary Jo to the bridge in Ted's car, force fed her with a knock out potion of alcoholic beverage, placed her in the back seat, and caused the car to accelerate off the side of the bridge into the water. They broke the windows on one side of the car to insure the entry of water; then they watched the car until they were sure Mary Jo would not escape.

Mary Jo actually regained consciousness and pushed her way to the top of the car (which was actually the bottom of the car - it had landed on its roof) and died from asphyxiation. The group with Teddy revived him early in the morning and let him know he had a problem. Possibly they told him that Mary Jo had been kidnapped. They told him his children would be killed if he told anyone what had happened and that he would hear from them. On Chappaquiddick, the other group made contact with Markham and Gargan, Ted's cousin and lawyer. They told both men that Mary Jo was at the bottom of the river and that Ted would have to make up a story about it, not revealing the existence of the group. One of the men resembled Ted and his voice sounded something like Ted's. Markham and Gargan were instructed to go the the Vineyard on the morning ferry, tell Ted where Mary Jo was, and come back to the island to wait for a phone call at a pay station near the ferry on the Chappaquiddick side.

The two men did as they were told and Ted found out what had happened to Mary Jo that morning. The three men returned to the pay phone and received their instructions to concoct a story about the "accident" and to report it to the police. The threat against Ted's children was repeated at that time.

Ted, Markham and Gargan went right away to police chief Arena's office on the Vineyard where Ted reported the so-called "accident." Almost at the same time scuba diver John Farror was pulling Mary Jo out of the water, since two boys who had gone fishing earlier that morning had spotted the car and reported it.

Ted called together a small coterie of friends and advisors including family lawyer Burke Marshall, Robert MacNamara, Ted Sorenson, and others. They met on Squaw Island near the Kennedy compound at Hyannisport for three days. At the end of that time they had manufactured the story which Ted told on TV, and later at the inquest. Bob Cutler calls the story, "the shroud." Even the most cursory examination of the story shows it was full of holes and an impossible explanation of what happened. Ted's claim that he made the wrong turn down the dirt road toward the bridge by mistake is an obvious lie. His claim that he swam the channel back to Martha's Vineyard is not believable. His description of how he got out of the car under water and then dove down to try to rescue Mary Jo is impossible. Markham and Gargan's claims that they kept diving after Mary Jo are also unbelievable.

The evidence for the Cutler scenario is substantial. It begins with the marks on the bridge and the position of the car in the water. The marks show that the car was standing still on the bridge and then accelerated off the edge, moving at a much higher speed than Kennedy claimed. The distance the car travelled in the air also confirms this. The damage to the car on two sides and on top plus the damage to the windshield and the rear view mirror stanchion prove that some of the damage had to have been inflicted before the car left the bridge.

The blood on the back and on the sleeves of Mary Jo's blouse proves that a wound was inflicted before she left the bridge. The alcohol in her bloodstream proves she was drugged, since all witnesses testified she never drank and did not drink that night. The fact that she was in the back seat when her body was recovered indicates that is where she was when the car hit the water. There was no way she could have dived downward against the inrushing water and moved from the front to the back seat underneath the upside-down seat back.

The wounds on the back of Ted Kennedy's skull, those just above his ear and the large bump on the top indicate he was knocked out. His actions at the hotel the next morning show he was not aware of Mary Jo's death until Markham and Gargan arrived. The trip to the pay phone on Chappaquiddick can only be explained by his receiving a call there, not making one. There were plenty of pay phones in or near Ted's hotel if he needed to make a private call. The tides in the channel and the direction in which Ted claimed he swam do not match. In addition it would have been a superhuman feat to have made it across the channel (as proven by several professionals who subsequently tried it).

Deputy Sheriff Christopher Look's testimony, coupled with the testimony of Ray LaRosa and two Lyons girls, proves that there were two people in Ted's car with Mary Jo at 12:45 pm. The three party members walking along the road south toward the cottage confirmed the time that Mr. Look drove by. He stopped to ask if they needed a ride. Look says that just prior to that he encountered Ted's car parked facing north at the juncture of the main road and the dirt road. It was on a short extension of the north-south section of the road junction to the north of the "T". He says he saw a man driving, a woman in the seat beside him, and what he thought was another woman lying on the back seat. He remembered a portion of the license plate which matched Ted's car, as did the description of the car. Markham, Gargan and Ted's driver's testimony show that someone they talked to in the pitch black night sounded like Ted and was about his height and build.

ragzamuffin · 3 months ago

Rest in Peace Mary Jo and Senator Kennedy, inextricably linked for eternity. You leave behind us mere mortals to judge your tragedy and reassure ourselves that we will continue our lives of exemplary behavior, continued prayers for your souls and activism that will solve this injustice for future generations. San

jeanLorelle · 3 months ago

What about redemption? I continually marvel at how many Christians today ignore the actual teachings of Jesus. As I recall, you could sin and redeem yourself...The one thing I know about Ted Kennedy is that he was a staunch supporter of the poor and disenfranchised - the core of Jesus' teachings. He upheld this as a goal steadfastly even though he didn't have to...he was able to do so because he was rich enough to fund his own campaigns and guaranteed re-election year after year - enabling him to vote his conscience rather than the will of corporate America. So, ask yourselves, what have you done for the poor? Are you, like most Americans, happy to have your foot in the face of your fellow man, just to get ahead? Our empire is ending because Americans today no longer work towards common goals to better one another..but instead only work toward ends that benefit themselves. No empire can support itself with this philosophy. Farewell to one politician who felt that the whole was more important than the "me,me, me".